“You’re a Quaker? You mean, like, Amish?” It’s something every Quaker has heard. Max Carter educates us on the differences between the two.
Resources:
- Subscribe to QuakerSpeak so you never miss a video
- Quakers aren’t Amish, but they are open to learning from the Amish, as suggested in the Friends Journal article “Forgiveness: An Amish Lesson for the Rest of Us?”
- Many thanks to Margaret Freed for allowing use of her illustration
- Explore the Quaker way to see if it could be right for you
- Read Friends Journal to see how other Friends describe the substance of Quaker spirituality
- Worship with Friends! Find Quakers near you on QuakerFinder and Friends Journal’s meeting listings
Transcript:
Are Quakers Amish? That’s a question that almost everyone who goes to Guilford College (where we’re filming this today) gets. A number of my students will say when they find out they’re going to a Quaker College, “Will we have to ride a horse? Will we have to give up electricity? Will we have to wear gray?”
What I often tell my students is the main difference between the Quakers and the Amish is that the Amish drive their own buggy; Quakers drive others buggy.
Are Quakers Amish?
The real answer is that there’s a spiritual connection between the Quakers and the Amish. There’s no organic connection between the Quakers and the Amish.
The Amish grew out of the radical reformation, the anabaptist movements of the 1500’s and 1600’s, out of southern Germany, the Alsace area of France and Switzerland in response to the protestant reformation, and a desire to take those reforms further, to create the “true church” of adult, voluntary believers who accept the discipline of the church and associated themselves around the gospels especially and lived out the meaning of the gospels in plainness, in simplicity, in adult baptism, and pacifism, or what they would call “biblical nonresistance.”
The Quakers emerged out of the English Civil War period a century later. Similar desires to restore original Christianity—it was a restorationist movement too—but there’s no organic connection with what was happening on the continent.
How Quaker Used to Dress
The reason so many people make the mistake of equating the Quakers with the Amish is the Amish dress the way that Quakers used to. The Amish came into the American colonies in the early 1700’s on the invitation of William Penn and other Quakers to Pennsylvania for religious freedom. They came as German Peasant stock, dressing like German Bauern would dress, and they looked at their Quaker neighbors and saw them dressing in their broad brim hats and bonnets and plain clothes and said, “works for us.”
The Differences Between Quakers and Amish
But there are very significant differences between the Amish and the Quakers. The Amish, for example, believe in separation from a fallen world. A fundamental theological understanding is to be separate. “Come out from among them and be ye separate.”
Quakers have followed William Penn’s dictate of “loving the world with weaned affections,” to be “in the world but not of it,” so Quakers have not been as separate from the world.
The Amish have a theology that is still fairly Calvinist without the pre-destination. Quakers have a theology that is more open to the possibility of understanding one’s salvation in this life. The Amish will not talk about eternal assurance or the ability to know in this life whether one is in reconciliation with God.
And quite importantly, the Amish do not allow women to speak or have authority in church. Quakers from the very beginning have always seen the spiritual equality of men and women. So if you go to an Amish worship service, which is 3 and a half hours in German, women will not speak a word, unless they’re singing a hymn. There are no women in authority, no women in leadership, and that just isn’t the case among Quakers.
There are also a variety of differences in terms of form. Quakers do not use the outward forms of baptism and communion typically, and those are very central to Anabaptist and Amish understanding. The importance of baptism as a sign of entering into the church as an adult, and the importance twice a year of the Lord’s supper, foot washing as well.
I found Max Carter’s video about the Amish and Quakers interesting.
Perhaps there could be a similar discussion about the Mennonites and Quakers.
Where I live there are both Amish and Mennonite communities.
Thank you from Pat
Strikes me funny to see this as I just had this happen. Seems alot of conversations where I mention I am a Quaker include: “Horse and buggy?” No that’s the Amish. “White mesh caps and Ten Thousand Villages?” That’d be the Mennonites. “Buckle shoes and the Mayflower? ” You’re thinking of the pilgrims. “Oh like the oatmeal?” Um, yeah. Like the oatmeal. But not really.
Thank you for this wonderfully succinct and clear explanation of the roots of the Amish vs. that of Quakers, as well as some of the theological differences. I was surprised to learn that the Amish got the idea of plain dress from the Quakers in the US! These videos are providing such a service of education and enlightenment — for the public as well as for our own Quaker meetings. Much gratitude!
I find this series very enlightening. My heritage is Quaker, I was raised Episcopal. I find myself searching and this series is very good. I wish my relatives were alive to help me help myself but these videos are a great step forward.
As an aside, a relative was instrumental in founding Guildford College!
My ancestors were Sloopers from Norway.
Many were Quakers. I could be happy being a Quaker,
but need more info on those beliefs. Non-war is the big
plus for me.
I admire Max Carter as well. I too Graduated from Guilford College. I majored in Psychology & minored in Women’s Studies. I must say that I also attended friends meetings throughout my life, and even went to Yearly meeting @ Guilford as a 16 yr. old teenager. I always wanted to grow up & go to Guilford College. Graduated in December, 2008. I loved going to the “Hut” and for me I know I am a friend. This is so indescribably important 2 my daily life. 4 me. it is knowing that I have a personal relationship with the Holy Spirit & listening 2 the stillness and the warmth of nature that has been gifted to us for our pleasure & our compassion for all living things.
This is an interesting essay, but a great oversimplification of the topic. Many important differences between Friends (which group?) and the Amish (which group?) are left unmentioned and unexplored.
I have lived and worshipped with Mennonites and German Baptists for much of my life, and have Amish friends. I am an Orthodox/Conservative Friend.
A preliminary attempt to do this topic justice would call for an issue of *Quaker Religious Thought* or some other medium, with Friends and Anabaptists as the theme. I think we have a lot to learn from the Anabaptists about how to function as a Christian faith community. And they could learn much from us. Their relative success and enormous growth in numbers would probably make them less interested in what Friends, a declining movement hereabouts, have to offer. But, in our more honest and humble moments, we might be able to open ourselves to their insights!
Hi Bill! Thanks for your comment. I agree that the format of a 3 minute YouTube video allows for only a superficial exploration. I will certainly pass on your suggestion to my colleagues at Friends Journal. I think the topic would be an interesting one.
-Jon
I don’t know. I was with the Amish and salvation was a very heavily discussed topic and the teachings of Jesus were as well. And some sermons, if there was someone visiting that did not speak German they would have it in English. Otherwise it was a good comparison. Thank you
Carol: *Quaker Sloopers: From the Fjords to the Prairies* by Wilmer Tjossem. Friends United Press, 1984.
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If the followers of a particular way of life refrain from emphasising their differences and instead focus on our common humanity and shared destiny – the world will be a better place.
Ralph Rau: I understand and agree with your general point, but understanding the differences among various groups, be they religious, political, or other, is an invaluable part of the process of finding common ground. The presentation was without any hint of animosity or judgement and serves to foster effective communication.
I dove headfirst into my Quaker roots at Earlham College, my parents’ alma mater. I fell in love with a Quaker girl my first week, and my interest in the faith of 3 of 4 grandfathers escalated from there. My father was birthright, as were both of my grandfathers. But I was not, and became an “official” Quaker in 1969, my first year at Earlham. The peace testimony and an escalating war (under a Quaker president no less!) made my decision clear and easy. I am very proud to say I am a Quaker.
My great grandfather maternal side was a
Quaker. My mother said he was very strict
And tough on my grandmother growing up. My mother said we were part Pennsylvania Dutch but insisted we were holland Dutch. I know there’s a lot of French on both sides of my family so all I know is my great grandfather was a Quaker
“STUDY to show thyself approved unto God”. I’m better for having followed that scriptural directive to discover the difference between Amish and Quaker, rather than remaining in ignorance. I, too, had wrongly assumed the two were merely slight variants of the same People, and I apologize. Thank you for explaining this.